Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by DeviateDefiant, Wednesday 6th Aug, 2014.
Do they make a 2.4 RHD ?
We all wish it my friend, I'd take this as a 9th Generation replacement. The body on the production model is looking far more desirable than we saw on the concept.
As the yanks would say I am digging it.
Dredging up an old thread, what's are people's opinions here on Acura, and could it work as a brand in the UK?
If done right, it could allow Honda to aim at a higher segment of the market with the Accord/TLX and with more upmarket crossovers like the RDX (posh CR-V) and MDX (X5 size car), while allowing the Civic and Jazz to chase more volume.
Lexus has been successful in the UK, but Infiniti has been a disaster.
Do you guys want Acura in your country? Presently, it looks like you get a couple of the models without the mustache; which is a great upgrade, but Acura is really earning a reputation for being a conservative "near luxury" accountants car. They traded from making luxury cars in the 90s to making sport sedans in the 00s to making some kind of economical sedan with 300HP on a front drive platform that needs to be too firm for it's own good to put down power. And the TLX doesn't seem to put down power unless you get the SH-AWD because it's got a ridiculous 8 speed automatic with short 30, 50, 75 gearing on skinny low rolling resistance 225 section tires. Or you get the four banger but who wants a 3500 pound (1600kg) shipping barge.
I do really like the look of it, including the grille . At least it's different...
Interesting points about the Acura brand in the United States, @Captain Slow.
I'd only welcome Acura into the UK as a brand if it meant a much expanded model range - so a replacement for our Accord, and the reintroduction of a Legend as a minimum, with a luxury MPV and a larger SUV (to compete with the Audi Q7, BMW X5 etc) as well, ideally. As it stands, with Honda in the UK, we're going to be left with just the Jazz, Civic, HR-V and CR-V, with the NSX to come.
The market over here in the UK is obsessed with the German brands - especially Audi & BMW - and I doubt whether introducing Acura could turn back that tide now...
Has the legend stopped selling recently? Not that I think you're missing much. It's basically a test mule for the TLX. Last time I checked, fewer than 1000 RL's (Legends) sold in the US per year.
Also confusing for me is that I see what is the Acura TSX in the US badged as an Accord Tourer or something in the UK (you drive what I know as the TSX). That must have been taken away from you because of course the TSX has been condensed into the TLX and is made in Ohio (which probably won't be exported anywhere). In the US, our Accord is the conservatively styled but quietly dignified looking car with a bit too much silver plastic trim on the inside. Frankly, I'd kind of a like an Accord coupe but I'd need the v6 and the rest of the car, brakes especially, aren't really built for it.
Don't get yourself too upset. The UK still gets all the Type-R's. We've only ever gotten the Integra R. The American market can't be bothered with a small displacement sports car so we get left high and dry.
That was kind of my point. We may not like to admit it, but these days, anything Accord-sized or bigger struggles to sell in the UK unless it has a premium badge on the bonnet. With Acura established in the UK, Honda could carry on selling that range you described above, while Acura sells the bigger cars (and probably the NSX)
It can be done. Look at Audi. Most people are well aware that VW and Audi share a lot of components, but they still happily buy Audis because they like the brand and they like the looks and they like the ownership experience.
Building a luxury brand is not cheap (I dread to think how much Toyota spent on establishing Lexus from scratch) but if it gets you into the world of selling high-margin saloons and crossovers, then the cost is justified. I guess it depends on how seriously Honda takes the UK/European market.
We haven't had a Legend on sale here since about 2008, @Captain Slow
Shame about the Type-R's in the USA, but at least (I assume!) you'll get the NSX
^^Yes, I see your point now. Spot on - it could be done if Honda have the will and are willing to invest in the UK market.
Never mind the Type-Rs, Americans still get a 280bhp V6 Accord for $31k...
It's tricky, though. Lexus imitates german luxury brands. They have many rear drive offerings and V8 options. Acura has been developing cars that are technologically innovative. That's their thing. It worked pretty well for them through the 90s and 00s but now every Civic and Corolla has an optional sat nav with backup camera. That's why, by my estimation, they're now pushing to be more economical. The TLX has hidden it's exhaust pipes under the rear bumper and put skinny tires on to get 30 MPG. It's working alright because there's brand loyalty in the US but the UK and other european markets would likely look at Acura and think it was some watered down luxury knock off.
Acura was the first Japanese luxury brand in the US (or anywhere). The reason it worked is because their initial offerings, the legend and Integra, rattled BMWs cage. Acura did a number of things better. Then the second generations came out and really embarrassed BMW. After that BMW improved their offerings and other Japanese luxury brands entered the market so things got less exciting. But that's why it exists at all today.
I did not know that. I wouldn't get too excited for me. It will be 20 years before I can afford the new NSX.
You don't get those? I am sorry. Though, again, all they do is bolt some 235 section tires on. It needs thicker sway bars and bigger brakes to balance out. As is, it's some kind of hot rod. I still want one but I'm just saying, there's a reason it's $31k. Do you at least get accord coupes? Because I haven't seen any of those in the garage on here.
That looks fantastic, the interior is abit generic looking though.
Personally do not want Acura in UK, the name and brand means nothing to me, has no history or heritage, I buy a Honda because its a Honda, I like saying I'm a Honda enthusiast and my favourite cars are Honda, not Acura.
Secondly I don't think it will work at all. Infiniti for example only entered Europe as a very small volume maker, which is why you hardly see them and secondly they know how hard it is to break into this market from scratch, they are being realistic. Acura will be the exact same thing, they will sell couple of hundred cars a year, it won't make any business sense at all. Lexus also aren't as successful as you might think they are in Europe. They have been in the game for nearly 30 years, and they are still just a bit part player in the premium luxury market and they sell themselves on the basis of a being left field and an alternative to the German brigade. If i remember correctly they also aren't massively profitable but they have the financial backing of the worlds biggest car maker.
Fact of the matter is in Europe, and in UK particular, they love their German brands no matter what, its never going to change either. If Honda want to release cars like this sell it under the Honda brand, they had a big and loyal following once, they've lost that out of their own Accord.
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Also I've noticed even in America, many people don't like the Acura branding, and when they buy something like the old TSX euro Accord, they rebadge it to Honda.
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We don't get Accord coupes, the last coupe was in the 90's, the best era for Honda's before they decided to start winding down in Europe, perhaps the after effects of the loss of Rover. You guys are lucky you still get some nice mainstream models like the Accord and Civic coupe. Here in UK, for the last couple of years or so we have just had two small hatches in Civic and Fit, the CR-V and the Accord/TSX which is dead now.
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This is crazy. I've done a google search to figure things out for myself. Your Accord is a TSX and you get no Accord. Plus your Civic is a hatch. Which makes me wonder why you'd bother considering a Fit (Jazz). I had no idea the models were so different. I thought the Civic and Accord, at a minimum, were a world wide phenomenon. I suppose they are, but in very different styles. [/my_education]
It's not that Americans are rebadging their Acura's because they'd prefer a Honda. Those people just want to be different and get a rise out of people. "Wow, Accords these days are really something".
Honda enthusiasts in America don't feel very lucky to have the mainstream models. The Civic Si is out classed by the FR-S, Fiesta ST, and GTI. The CR-Z is a hybrid joke. The Accord is nice, but who wants a Honda Accord when Acura, Mercedes, BMW, and others have entry level luxury for the same price. Yes, you technically get more options for less money in the Accord but America is so rotten for their luxury branding. My sister-in-law just bought an Acura ILX: a Civic drivetrain and chassis with more sophisticated interior and exterior styling. $30k she paid to have it fully loaded. An Accord v6 would be way nicer, and only a bit less sophisticated with it's silver plastic interior trim. I wish I could have talked her out of that. Never got the chance.
The RLX is the 5th Generation Legend
The RL the 3rd/4th Generation Legend
The TSX is the 7th/8th Generation Accord
The RSX is the 4th Generation Integra
The TL is the Saber/Inspire (JDM Only)
The Fit is the Jazz
Some of your previous Civic/Accords are rebadged from other JDM Honda models as well, the CR-V, CR-Z, Insight, HR-V etc. are all the same model. You also have the Odyssey which we don't have, the Pilot, Crosstourer and others. Many later Acuras are unique and not rebadged like the ILX, RDX and MDX (1st Generation was sold as the Honda MDX in Japan), but often borrow heavily from existing models.
Yeh the Euro Accord is rebranded as a Acura TSX in North America, it is actually originally an Accord, it was rebranded as an Acura for NA market. The Honda Civic has always originally been a hatchback, you guys get a few different shapes like saloon and coupe, but here in Europe the market is different, small hatchbacks are the most popular segment ala the VW Golf, so we have always had a continous hatchback shape of the Civic, there have been coupe and saloons also in the past ranges but they are low volume selling. The Fit/Jazz is small than the Civic, it is a supermini, think of it as a rival to the VW Polo. A lot of these cars remember are adjusted to suit the tastes and requirements of the market they are going to be sold in.
I think I've got it all straight. I guessed my way through some kanji to compare models to the Japanese market. The JDM Civic is the Grace which is a saloon and looks like a luxury offering with leather and jewel headlights. An up sell from the strange little box cars Japan seems to enjoy. The European hatch phenomenon is an entirely different matter. Hatches are quite rare over here but when I do see them, they're the performance models. They tend to attract a gross Euro-tuner crowd, though "German-tuner" would be more accurate. You'd think these kids bought a Porsche or a Bugatti by their arrogance and they're eager to point out that business relation. That discussion probably deserves it's own thread.
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