Bulletins & Advisories 4th Generation All-Wheel Drive (AWD): Software Glitch

Discussion in '4th Generation (2013-2017)' started by Service News, Monday 29th Apr, 2013.

  1. Service News Staff Managed Dealer Information

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    Another round of software updates for the new 4th Generation CR-V. Honda released the TSB # SN-04-001-00 dated 29-04-13 for the following CR-V chassis models. For new CR-V owners you should not worry too much as dealer would have uploaded this software to the car at PDI. Its more for knowledge base for future reference.

    ModelModel CodeYear Model
    CR-VRE5, RE72013
    CR-V I-DTECRE62013

    The Symptoms
    AWD (All Wheel Drive) system might not work as expected. For example, if the driver tries to pull away from an icy road situation, the AWD warning light comes on prematurely. The driver may also notice that there is no rear wheel rotation while the front wheels spin.

    AOCUK CRV AWD Software update1.JPG

    The Cause
    Under certain conditions, torque to the rear axle was not optimised due to AWD ECM software setting.

    The Repair Method
    The AWD ECU Software has been optimised to allow more torque transfer to the rear axle under certain conditions.

    Application to Production Line= Please check if you car is after this cut off
    SHSRE5***DU013968 Europe - KE/KG
    SHSRE5***DU100281 South Africa - KN
    SHSRE5***DU210763 Russia - KR
    SHSRE6***DU019938 Europe - KE/KG
    SHSRE6***DU100339 South Africa - KN
    SHSRE7***DU100581 South Africa - KN

    Please note you as the customer have to approach the dealer if your car has these symptoms, but we suggest you have it irrespective. Your car should have the latest patches applied.
     
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  2. TheDarkKnight Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    Think mine won't need this as date of manufacture and VIN range is different.
     
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  3. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Hello,
    Thanks for this information. Much appreciated as I had this AWD update applied after reading this service bulletin. My vehicle is a 2013 CR-V auto: SHSRE****DU013372.

    I did get stuck in sand, the front wheels were spinning in the sand digging the sand out and the spin forced the front wheels deep down, whereas the back wheels did not rotate (spin) at all, even though rear wheels had a good traction, thus a AWD failure. That is the reason why I found this site after searching the web.

    I had same symptoms like in this youtube video as the AWD rear wheels did not spin in the sand, though the front wheels were spinning.:



    The HONDA team actually found 3 updates available for my 2013 A/T CR-V:
    1. AWD
    2. Engine/Gearbox (A/T)
    3. VSA/ABS
    The 1 and 2 updates were carried out on spot however the 3 was not carried out since I have to book for another appointment as I was not scheduled for all 3 updates (just the AWD) and they said they need half a day (4 hours) to carry out the VSA/ABS update.
    1. What is this VSA/ABS update??? which I have not had the privilage to install?
    2. What did the Engine/GearBox (A/T) update fix?
    3. Why is the following solenoid fix regarding AWD not applicable for my vehicle SHSRE****DU013372?
    "The AWD oil pressure control solenoid construction has been revised. The plunger diameter and hardness levels heave been increased to prevent bending and distortion of the plunger tip."

    Thanks for all information. HONDA never informed me of any updates/service bulletins and I am glad that I found this info here.
     
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  4. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
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    Is the 4th Generation CR-V an electronic AWD?
     
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  5. DeviateDefiant Co-Founder Staff Team

    United Kingdom Leo Northants
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  6. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Honda CR-V 2013/2014 is a real time AWD with intelligent control system.
    Real Time AWD

    The new Real Time AWD still uses a multi-plate clutch, similar to the clutches used in Honda automati
    c transmissions, to connect the driveshaft to the rear differential. But in place of the twin hydraulic pumps and ball cam mechanism used previously, the system now uses an electric motor driving a single hydraulic pump, which operates the clutch. The electric motor is controlled by the Intelligent Control System, which means that the system can actively apportion power based on the conditions.
    System operation is completely automatic and virtually transparent in smoothness.
    The Intelligent Control System function of Real Time AWD cooperates with the VSA and EPS to assist the driver in maintaining vehicle control.
    For efficiency, the electric motor activating the hydraulic pump is idled when not required, further reducing drag within the system and helping to reduce energy consumption.
    Compared to the previous model’s Real Time 4WD, the new Real Time AWD design weighs 17 percent less (approximately 36 pounds total system weight) and has 60 percent less rotational drag compared to the previous-generation’s Real Time 4WD system.
    Unlike some four-wheel-drive systems that require the driver to select a drive mode based on the perceived need, Real Time AWD’s automatic operation means the system is always ready to transfer torque to the rear wheels, allowing the driver to focus more on driving when situations are demanding.
     
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  7. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
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    Cheers. Is it the SH-AWD in the 4th Generation?
     
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  8. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Yes 4th Generation
    - - - Updated - - -
    Thanks for your welcoming. I hope that Ichiban helps with his knowledge.
     
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  9. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Hello,
    Is the ABS/VSA software update/patch just a fix for the VSA mulfunction when new tyres are installed?

    The problem that arises with new tyres:
    When new Tyres are installed tyre pressure is not recognised and this causes the VSA to disengage? (VSA light stays on)?

    Otherwise the VSA update does not fix anything else. Is this a correct assumption regarding ABS/VSA update???

    Do I really need this update before my next service? HONDA Service does not inform me of any updates needed for my AWD CR-V. They are just reactive to complaints and not proactive.

    Thanks for your attention.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Tuesday 4th Nov, 2014
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  10. crvgen4 Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

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    I was really happy to see this TSB posted as I've been trying to check if the updated software has been applied to my vehicle?

    Have checked the VIN against Honda UK's Updates and Recalls page (Updates & Recalls | Owners | Honda UK but nothing showing. Would a TSB like this even show there?

    I've also asked the supplying dealership to tell me if the patches have been applied, but they are unsure. Any ideas how to get this checked and if necessary have the new software applied?

    Thanks
     
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  11. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Book an appointment with the dealer. Ask them to plug in their scanner and check for all firmware updates available. They will check individuall your cars ECU, the AWD, the VSA/ABS, and a couple of others but only the three forementioned had an update on my 2013 production car. The 2014 have less problems.

    Good luck.
     
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  12. crvgen4 Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

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    @PanayiotisPal - thanks, that's just the advice I needed. I'll get in touch with the dealer. If it's just plugging in and checking for the updates, then downloading to fix, that's a simple route to resolving.

    Out of interest, did you find out what your engine / gearbox (AT) fix was for?
     
  13. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    No problem. We are here to give our knowledge/experience to others and I am glad to help out and point you to the right direction.

    By usage, after the ECU/gearbox update, I have not seen/experienced/felt any difference to the drive of the car. However If I remember well I read something about carbon dioxide and the better usage of the fuel so that the sensors don't get blocked by the carbon build up that will result in a red light. I have read it somewhere here in the TSBs for the CR-V. I am sure if you read the forum of the CR-V generation 4 you will find it:Smile:. Maybe a better knowledge person than me can give a better explanation as I am not a Honda technician/enginee.
    - - - Updated - - -
    Actually I have seen a minor difference on the dashboard. When I open the door it displays brake + start button:Smile:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Tuesday 4th Nov, 2014
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  14. crvgen4 Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

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    Right - sounds more like an emissions tweak. But the AWD patch is more significant. It's got the makings of a PR disaster for Honda if they don't make this an upgrade. It was hard work to track this exceedingly useful info down, which is now being referenced in various other threads across the web that have been talking about the CR-V's poor AWD performance..
     
  15. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    Yes and the laughing story is that the third test was also a 2013 model with the old AWD firmware that is why it failed :Smile: Whereis the second test was a pass since the CR-V had the AWD firmware update installed.

    The CR-V with firmware update passes the scandinavian AWD test but if they take a 2013 model without the firmware update it will fail. I have seen the specs of the model they have done that they claim it is a 2014 model and it is actually a 2013 model. The third test of the CR-V which they claim was a 2014 model its VIN is SHSRE6790DU010852 so it is a 2013 without the AWD update.
    And this is a laughing story. CR-V AWD rocks (only with the firmware patch).
     
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  16. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
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    That story is total BS CR-V is a AWD car not a 4x4 car with VSA on it wants to behave like a 2 wheel drive car it will want to limit power to the rear wheel until the front are in control... Drr

    if you want to test that Swedish test do it on ICE with VSA disabled then watch .
     
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  17. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    If VSA is disabled there is more torque. But even with VSA on the test was a pass with the firmware applied. Their test car is with the old AWD firmware. Its vehicle identification number is within the CARS that should have been updated. HONDA has not made this firmware update mandatory but only on demand.
    - - - Updated - - -
    It should however be standard on all 2014 models
    - - - Updated - - -
    To cut the long story short the AWD firmware update allows more torque transfer to the rear wheels when the front wheels are freely rotating/spinning.
     
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  18. crvgen4 Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

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    All software updated and it certainly seems that there is more transfer of torque to the rear when the fronts are in a zero grip situation. Thanks to the OP for the heads up and @PanayiotisPal for the advice.

    Now all we need is a significant snowfall in the UK for some proper field testing.
     
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  19. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
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    Just another point and I'm not sure if this effects the CR-V (4th Generation and earlier) but I remember the owners manual for the Hyundai I was driving in Australia said that their stability assist reduces fuel economy.

    As for traction, I get significantly more traction when pulling away strong on a slippy surface with VSA disabled.
     
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  20. PanayiotisPal Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

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    :Smile: You are welcome.

    I need some snowfall too for more AWD experience.

    Can anyone do the Scandenavian test (say 30% sloping test with the front wheels on rollers, meaning zero grip, and rear wheels full load)?? I guess the model they have tested is without the firmware applied, and this test has to be given a second chance with a proper AWD, firmware updated, CR-V.

    Regards
    Panayiotis
     
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