Facelift Model Accord Type-S Diesel (8th Generation) vs. new Mazda 6 2.2. diesel

Discussion in '8th Generation (2008-2015) [Acura TSX]' started by Julianp, Saturday 10th Aug, 2013.

  1. Julianp Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paris
    55
    2
    I have been spending the past week in north Germany with a Mazda 6 as my hire car. Since these cars compete very closely in the market, I thought it might be interesting to share my impressions of the Mazda 6 - a 150 PS 2.2 diesel saloon - and compare them with the Accord Type-S diesel I have run for the past 15,000 miles at home in France. I have done about 500 miles in the Mazda, a mix of motorway trips to and from the airport, main roads and country back roads, so enough to get a decent impression of the car. I actually looked closely at the previous generation of the Mazda but decided against it because it was about to be replaced and felt less “premium” than the Honda. Mazda were also going through some well-publicized DPF issues with the previous version of their 2.2-litre diesel engine.
    The first thing that strikes you with the latest Mazda is its sheer size: at nearly 4.9m (16 feet) long, it's a big car. That translates into more rear seat legroom and a bigger (and more evenly shaped) boot than in the Accord, although those aren’t top considerations for me. But its size also makes it a very tight fit in some hotel and multi-storey car parks and this might put me off buying one.
    Inside, I still find the Accord to be better finished and my Type-S is better equipped than the version of the Mazda (a CenterLine spec in Germany) I had on hire. But I did like the Mazda’s improved Bluetooth integration over the 8th gen Accord, including the ability to stream music from my iPod Touch, with the Gracenote music information even being picked up for Spotify offline playlists. I haven’t tested the latest equipment in the Civic or the CR-V though, so Honda may well have caught up here already.
    On the road though, I have to say I was very impressed with the Mazda. The Skyactiv-D engine is really good and for my money a better unit than the i-DEC unit on the Accord. It has a wider usable rev range, picking up strongly with no perceptible lag from under 1,500 RPM and pulling through to 5,000 revs. The Honda engine is excellent when cruising but much noisier and thrashier when accelerating hard than the Mazda engine, which feels closer to a petrol unit. The 6 was also noticeably more economical than the Accord Type-S, in which I have averaged just over 50 MPG. In the Mazda I got close to 58 MPG, even with some 90+ mph cruising on the autobahn.
    In terms of handling and ride comfort, it’s probably unfair to compare the two cars directly: the Type-S has firmer sports suspension and 18” wheels whereas the Mazda model I drove was on 17” rims and had standard suspension. Unsurprisingly therefore the Mazda felt a bit softer with more roll in corners, but was still pretty impressive as a package, it just didn’t have the crispness of my Honda.
    If I was buying now, it would be a much tougher choice than it was in the spring of 2012 when I ordered my Accord. The size of the 6 would still concern me, but if Mazda put the 175PS/420Nm version of the diesel (as offered on the 6 and the CX-5) into the new version of the 3 which is coming at the end of this year that could make a cracking car. It will in any case be very interesting to see how the Accord story plays out in Europe and how the 9th gen – if we get it in France with a diesel engine – moves Honda’s game on.
    Julian.
     
  2. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,133
    6,388
    516
    I have said in the past the Mazda 6 was a game changer it has a lot of technology and strong points which makes the 8th Generation a bit dated. However it not correct to compare the current 6 with the 8th as it a newer car.

    When the 9th Generation does come it will be a good benchmark.
     
    Loading...
  3. Julianp Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paris
    55
    2
    Not correct to compare the current Accord with the current Mazda 6? I'm sorry, but that's the reality of the market: for someone shopping for a new car today those are the two models available. Not everyone will want or be able to wait for the 9th Generation Accord in 2014 (or 2015?). And by then Mazda will probably be heading towards a mid-cycle facelift to keep their car current. The 8th Generation Accord remains a good car, but there's some strong competition today.
     
  4. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,133
    6,388
    516
    8th Generation Accord launched 2008 Mazda 6 launched 2013 6 years of market advancements are already into the Mazda 6 which gives them a head start. Mazda 6 engines are already Euro 6 compliant so it going to be efficient ..

    However if you are looking at a new car the Mazda is a very good car and it will clinch a lot of Accord sales. Until the 9th Generation is not here I do see it as a fair point to compare these two cars.
     
    Loading...
  5. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    A friend of mine has a Mazda 6 diesel and his biggest disappointment is the pi$$ thin paintwork, to the extent that if he'd have known how bad it was he wouldn't have bought the car. When a stone hits the front of the car the paint is so thin it has no give in it so it just chips a lump out of the paintwork each time. But it doesn't just take the top coat off it takes the primer off as well and goes right down to the rust protection. He's recently had to have to whole front end of his car resprayed and it's only 5 years old.

    I was very impressed with the styling, engine, comfort and equipment in the car when he took me for a drive in it, but seeing the poor paintwork has put me off ever owning one.
     
    Loading...
  6. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    This was a really interesting review, thanks for taking the time to post it.

    ^^I looked at a CX5 before I bought my Accord, and felt the same, even though the CX5 was new to market. The interior just didn't feel that solid when compared to the Honda, and that worried me. The (leather) seats also seemed to me to be a bit "thin."

    I think that is where Honda will always score over Mazda, regardless of comparisons in the drive.

    ^^...and a quality point again. My Accord has done 20k miles in a year, mainly on the motorway. The front (plastic) bumper has suffered with chips, but not as badly as my previous VW. The main bodywork has hardly suffered any major chips at all, and that has really impressed and surprised me, if I'm honest.

    I'd also bet that the Accord will hold it's value better than the Mazda, but time will tell. Despite my comments above though, the Mazda 6 is a strong contender...for every month that goes by without a 9th Generation Accord.
     
    Loading...
  7. TheDarkKnight Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    2,688
    492
    I looked at the CX5 before the CR-V too. I just couldn't stand being in the cabin. Its cheap, nasty, poorly laid out and looked like it was ready to fall apart. I've seen the new 6 as well and that is exactly the same. It is truly hideous and sickly.


    That will only ring true of the UK/Euro market. But not the rest of the world :Smile:

    In key places like the US, Asia & Japan where the 9th Generation Accord is already there - the Mazda 6 is by no means a "first choice sedan" at all. If anything, its a "me too" car with nothing that can match the 9th Generation Accord at all. The Madza 6 is an also-ran, behind the game compared to the 9th Generation Accord - it only looks snazzy here in the UK because there isnt a direct competitor.

    Mazda can polish their turd all they like so it looks glitzy for silly car mag reviews and get a gold star or two - but their cars are still turds :Rolf:
     
    Loading...
  8. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    ^^My lasting memory of the CX5 I looked at was a tiny sat nav that looked like it had been bought from Halfords, and had been stuck into the middle of the dashboard as an afterthought! Weird...
     
    Loading...
  9. SpeedyGee Administrator Staff Team

    England Speedy Birmingham
    14,999
    5,593
    4
    I've had a couple of Mazda 6's they can't touch an Accord for comfort, refinement and quality.
    Wouldn't go back to one again personally.
     
    Loading...
  10. StuH Premium Member Club Supporter

    United Kingdom Stuart Lancashire
    608
    254
    1
    I just wish the 8th Generation had a bigger boot, then my next car would be an easy choice but the tourer is more like a hatchback and I need a big boot.
     
    Loading...
  11. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,133
    6,388
    516
    it a double edge sword better ride quality over space. The 8th Generation tourer handles better than the 7th. So its a trade off.

    let see if the 9th Generation Tourer get Active dampers and fuel tank moved under the front seats ?
     
    Loading...
  12. cred Senior Member ★ ★ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom London
    211
    66
    All things aside, I think great job for a decent review. As a Honda fan myself, I feel it is equally important to know how good or bad they are compared with the competition.
     
    Loading...
  13. damtom Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Damien
    29
    i know it is old topic but i didnt want start new one.

    i had a accord 7th Generation i was very happy with it and now im looking for something newer.

    i was just wondering why Type-S and mazda 6 175ps diesel are so different in performance - both weight over 2000kg , similar power( Type-S a bit more) and still mazda has 7.9s to 60mph and accord 8.8s. how is that possible?

    also anyone else has got expierence with this two cars?

    looking forward to your feedback
     
  14. TheDarkKnight Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    2,688
    492
    Considering the "difference" is under one second, how many of us real world drivers would even notice (or care!) about such a difference?

    I'll give you an example of something else. I drove the 170-odd BHP version of the Mazda CX5 prior to buying my 150BHP 4th Generation CR-V. The Mazda felt no quicker at all - despite having a little more torque and 20-odd extra horsepower.

    If anything, the CR-V is quicker off the mark from standstill thanks to its robust AWD as soon as you hit the pedal. The same effect in the Mazda never happened until a week or more had elapsed....
     
    Loading...
  15. Julianp Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paris
    55
    2
    Hi Damien, I think your numbers are somewhat out. The Mazda is about 250kg lighter than the Honda; the Mazda France website lists the saloon at 1405kg vs. 1659kg for the Type-S diesel saloon, again according to Honda France. In general, Mazda has made a big effort to cut the weight of all its recent cars. In addition, the Mazda has rather more torque (420Nm) than the Honda (380Nm). I think those two factors explain the difference in performance. My subjective impression of the lower-powered (150PS) Mazda 6 was that there was less turbo lag and quicker pick-up below 2000rpm.
    Julian.
     
  16. damtom Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Damien
    29

    yes you are right about weight , my mistake autotrader confused with their details. according to mazda uk 175bhp diesel is 1562kg so 97kg less than Type-S

    to Thedarkknight one second is not a lot but on race with mazda 6 i will loose in Type-S :Smile:))
     
  17. TheDarkKnight Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    2,688
    492
    No offence, but why race?

    Neither vehicle is a performance sports car....and in real life, how many people *really* race on public roads... :Blink:
     
    Loading...
    Ichiban likes this.
  18. damtom Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Damien
    29
    i drive a lot through europe and as we know there is few places where is no limits and after 10 hours of driving people do lots of things just to not be bored, for example racing with others cars.
     
  19. damtom Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Damien
    29
    can you tell me how good is clutch in Type-S , is there problem with pressure disc like it was in 7th Generation that even on factory software you could damage clutch easily ? did they improve clutch quality in Type-S and is there option for remap where clutch will survive
     
  20. TheDarkKnight Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    2,688
    492
    Still, thats an exception - not the rule. And for the sake of one second between two non-performance road saloons, its not the end of the world.
     
    Loading...