Suspension, Steering and Brakes ATR brake upgrade

Discussion in '7th Generation (2003-2008) [Acura TSX]' started by Doc, Sunday 17th Feb, 2013.

  1. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    While washing my car today I noticed that my front brake pads are getting low. This will also mean a front disc change this time as well.

    This got me onto thinking about an ATR brake upgrade. I have a diesel so it has the 300 mm front discs.

    Question is if I change the callipers to ATR twin pot are the brake discs still the same as what's currently on there?

    Thanks
     
    Loading...
  2. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,099
    6,367
    516
    Yup remove old calliper and carrier reuse the knuckle bolts (110Nm) Install new 300 mm disc for your CN1,attach ATR carrier to knuckle insert ATR brake pads then calliper/brake hose , lastly bleed ..job done

    Just for your info I have had ATR calliper on my CM2 for 45 miles they are still the original pads and discs when I upgraded, plenty of meat left on them.

    CM1 pads have cover 59 K miles and they are still strong the discs have a lip on them now. You will get phenomenal life out of them.

    I will get pictures when I strip them for the annual clean.
     
    Loading...
  3. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,099
    6,367
    516
    Doc sod ATR if you can get the 8th Generation Type-S or 2.4 callipers and disc you will be in braking heaven. makes the ATR callipers look like Fred Flintstones feet!

    it will work on the 7th Generation but you will need 17 inch wheels 16 will not work.
     
    Loading...
    Doc likes this.
  4. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    I've got 18 inch wheels is that good enough? LOL

    My current discs have lips on them so they need changing. The friction material on my pads is the same thickness as the backing plate so they need binning as well. As I would need to source ATR callipers I was thinking if the brake discs are the same size, do a standard disc and pad change straight away, then source some ATR callipers and upgrade. That way I could effectively reuse the new discs when I upgrade to the ATR callipers and the only wasted money would be on the standard pads as they wouldn't fit any more.

    I prefer the sound of upgrading to a newer rather than older design. Would the 8th Generation calliper and carrier fit straight on my hubs? What size are the discs and pads, and are the Type-S calliper twin pot as well?
     
    Loading...
  5. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    What size discs do the 8th Generation Type-S or 2.4 use? Would this brake upgrade be just as easy as an ATR one?
     
    Loading...
  6. AccordCU2 Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Discs on 2.4 are 340mm.can't answer second question,never done it myself.
     
    Loading...
  7. Paul Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    I did a refurb on Type-R calliper and swapped them on my last Accord. Tbh I couldn't notice any difference. I did it more for aesthetics as I painted them red. Made a few quid on them as well as they were in rotten condition when I bought them. They're becoming rare now though.
     
  8. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    I had a quick look on fleabay and saw at least 6 or 7 Type-R's being broken so I don't think the callipers should be too hard to get hold of, it's just getting a good deal on them.

    But if I can get some Type-S brakes instead and fit them just as easily it would seem silly not to do that instead. My current callipers have been painted red (rather crudely) by it's previous owner, so I'll likely get the replacement ones polymer coated red before fitting them so they match the rears.
     
    Loading...
  9. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    I've been doing a bit of research on the Type-S brake discs but can't get any dimensions for the hub fitment. Short of directly comparing the two can anyone offer any advice?
     
    Loading...
  10. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,099
    6,367
    516

    Type-S 8th Generation I-DTEC .its the same as the 2.4 Accord -8th Generation. what dimensions and weights do you need ?
     
    Loading...
  11. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,099
    6,367
    516
    :Aghast: dude there is noticeable difference , if you lift your right heel from the floor mat and use the balls of feet for pressure you will see you will get massive deceleration . I use my left foot for braking thou:Wink:

    The pivot on the floor mat does no give you consistent pressure. try it next time when you braking hard you will see a vast difference.
     
    Loading...
  12. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    On the 2.4 8th Generation disc the main dimensions I'm after are the centring hole diameter, is it the same as the 7th Generation? And are the positions of the locating screws the same? I assume the stud pattern is the same as 8th Generation wheels fit on 7th Generation cars don't they?!

    With the 8th Generation calliper carriers on the 7th Generation hubs will the 8th Generation disc and calliper line up properly?
     
    Loading...
  13. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,099
    6,367
    516
    Doc for Dimensions have a look at Diy Honda Accord 8th Generation Front Disc and pad replacement

    The centring hole diameter is the same as the 7th Generation
    The positions of the locating screws as same as the 7th Generation
    The stud pattern is the same as same as the 7th Generation I have Deltas on my 7th Generation Tourer

    With the 8th Generation calliper carriers on the 7th Generation hubs will the 8th Generation disc and calliper line up properly?

    Yes the Front knuckle has the same bolts the same torque setting and same location as the 7th Generation.

    However the disc splash guards on the 7th Generation are 300mm and since the disc for the 8th Generation are 343mm you will need to take a angle grinder and trim off the folded bead around the outer circumference and then seam seal it and coat it with high temperature paint.

     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sunday 30th Mar, 2014
    Loading...
  14. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    Thanks for all the info that's a big help. They look like they will be a straight swap. :Thumbup:

    Apart from the callipers and carriers will I also need the brake lines? Could I put the bigger splash guard on my hubs rather than modify my current ones?
     
    Loading...
  15. Doc Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    Matt Peterborough
    1,157
    202
    1
    I've been doing a bit of research on this and it would seem that it is not possible to simply change over the splash guard as the knuckle would have to be separated from the wheel hub in order to change it over. So the original splash guard would need to be modified to accept the bigger callipers and discs.

    Also I am struggling to locate a pair of Type-S or 2.4 callipers. There seems to be none of these models of car being broken.

    I'll need to make a decision in the next week which way I intend to go with this as I keep getting a soft pedal through lots of brake fade without even trying. The pads are no longer thick enough to dissipate the heat.
     
    Loading...
  16. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,099
    6,367
    516
    Yes mate that one thing I was going to get back to you upon and one the reason why I said to trim the edges to get by. However the beaded edges gives splash guard some extra rigidity as it folded metal.if we remove this it will lead to flexing and vibrations.

    Additionally the three Phillips head screws which hold the guard to the front knuckle the spacing and location may not be identical to the 7th Generation hub. if the 8th Generation front bearing unit is bigger then it will not be the same. I will do some measurements for you over the weekend for you.

    Cu2 Front Knuckle hub bearing splash removal.JPG

    We are nearly there this is the only hurdle for someone to take up the challenge and do it. On a bright note like the ATR calliper is someone finds a NSX first gen calliper that too will go on to the 7th Generation with no issues.

    Just bear in mind the NSX pads are expensive.. but you do get NSX stamped on the calipers :Whistle: