Facelift Model Engine oil level procedure

Discussion in '7th Generation (2003-2008) [Acura TSX]' started by mcgowanp, Friday 28th Jun, 2013.

  1. mcgowanp Senior Member ★ ★ ☆ ☆ ☆

    I think this may have come up countless times but i can't seem to find the other dicussions..

    What is the definite way to verify the the oil level on the Diesel I-CTDI engine. I see some commentators saying cold , some saying hot and some saying warm. This makes a huge difference in relation to marker level.
    I think i have also heard it mentioned that you should bring the car to normal temp - let it cool for 3minutes or so, then take a reading - I do not see this detailed anywhere from Honda.

    Generally what im seeing is that people saying cold say that they fill to the midpoint and the people using a warmer engine are filling to the max level.
    If i remember correctly the manual isnt all too detailed in this but i do not have it infront of me.
     
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  2. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

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    There is an official Honda oil checking procedure I did post it to the article section but never submitted it. :telloff:

    I will do it in a bit bud.
     
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  3. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

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  4. ann_kelvin Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Nice information. Now at least I know I am doing right :GoodJob:
     
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  5. mcgowanp Senior Member ★ ★ ☆ ☆ ☆

    That's great.. Lots of mis-info out there
     
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  6. ACC-CDI-2T Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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    Yes, thank you for this information :Smile: - for the diesel it´s a small "backpedalling" as the owners manual says - check the oil level in cold condition ..

    .. in this regard .. a link to estimate the thermal expansion of engineoil: Thermal Expansion - Volumetric or Cubic

    5,9 L engine oil at 20° C will expand to a volume of ~ 6,15 L at operating temperature 80°C (volumetric expansion coefficient of motor oil = ~ 0.0007 1/°C)
     
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  7. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

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    Honda have suggested to adopt this process of oil measurement and drop the cold oil measurement on diesel and petrol engines . The oil checking process used to be on bone cold engine. The wait for three minutes is sufficient for Honda then I suppose it's good for us? I have tried it on the petrol engine and so far so good.
     
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  8. mcgowanp Senior Member ★ ★ ☆ ☆ ☆

    I had a look at my manual and it does say to test when warm and to wait 3 minutes. I'm taking 'warm' to be when the engine is at its normally working temp? With the expansion and all things combined , i ensure it doesn't go higher than the max mark .
     
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  9. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

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    I personally think the reasoning behind this warm oil checking methodology would be they want all oil in the galleries and the passage ways and turbo,so its not sat in the sump giving you a higher erroneous reading

    Colder engine mean all the oil is sat in the sump? hot engine it still circulated around?
     
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  10. mcgowanp Senior Member ★ ★ ☆ ☆ ☆

    That makes sense to me but im not sure it is the actual case (with my car anyway). If i take a cold reading, it will be consistently lower that if i take a warm reading as described above when warm.Not sure if this is due themal expansion as mentioned earlier and if tis is considered with the procedure.
    This is kinda i reason i asked the question initally. If i took the reading at a lower engine temp, i may believe i need to top up the oil. If i top it up and take a reading while warm it could be well over the mark. It can also be quite a pain when your servicing your car.
     
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  11. ACC-CDI-2T Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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    Assumed "cold condition" means ~ -20°C in minimum and "warm condition" ~ +120°C in maximum, there would be a max. temperature difference of 140°C. This would lead to a max. thermal oilexpansion of ~ 0,6 L (which is ~ half the distance between min. and max. marking on the dipstick) for the 5.9 L oilfilling of the I-CTDI.

    So I think, it could be a practical and safe way, to fix the oil level in warm condition near the max. marking of the dipstick or near the "middleline" between the markings in cold condition. Both should hold the oil level within the markings for all temperatures and checking methods.

    But I´ll eat my hat, even a 0,5 L shortfalling below the min. marking as well as a 0,5 L exceeding of the max. marking would never damage a HONDA engine ... I´m 100% sure, that HONDA has provided a “safety volume”...
     
    Last edited: Monday 1st Jul, 2013
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  12. i-DSI Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    Hi Acccdi2t,
    My oil temp in petrol engines has never exceeded 100°C. It goes into the 90s range on highway only. In general I can say that the oil temp follows the engine coolant temp (between 85 - 93°C).
    It takes about 15 km of driving before oil temp reaches normal engine coolant temp. Depends a lot of driving conditions. Cold starting and slow driving it might take longer. Cold starting and immediately on highway only takes a few miles. I'd assume 'warm' around 80°c for the oil temp.

    Edit:
    'Cold' for mechanics means normally same temp as ambiant temp (e.g: valve clearance).
     
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  13. ACC-CDI-2T Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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    Hi I-DSI,

    make a trip across the boarder and visit me, the A4 has no speed limit :Smile:
     
    Last edited: Monday 1st Jul, 2013
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  14. i-DSI Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

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    I was in Munster only 2 months ago... Not Münster with the Umlaut, but Munster more in the North of Germany.
    Think you mean that in Germany my oil will get hotter no, :Wink:? Had nothing to measure when I drove on your Autobahns, but I can imagine that at 180 km/h you're right about that. Great to drive there, I like it. Like also the discipline on your roads.
     
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  15. ACC-CDI-2T Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

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    ... Yes, I think so, sometimes :eek: ... (this is the reason, why many german diesel drivers prefer a oil with a better High temperature High shear rate (HTHS) viscosity -> more wear resistance at high temperature (e.g. ACEA A3/B3 ore ACEA A3/B4 for Diesel without part. Filter)

    Did you also visit Lüneburg? I was there with my wife a few weeks ago – a nice old city in the Lüneburger Heide)

    p.s. @ I-DSI: I think your PM store is full ...
     
    Last edited: Thursday 4th Jul, 2013
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