Honda Jazz Pulling to the right

Discussion in '3rd Generation (2007-2015)' started by salmansandhu, Thursday 17th Dec, 2015.

  1. salmansandhu Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Salman London
    9
    4
    Hello,

    I have just introduced the car in the new owners section but unfortunately after about a few months of ownership I need some help and advice from you all.

    The car is consistently pulling to the right when the steering wheel is in the centre 12'o'clock position. We took it back to the supplying dealership who carried a FOC wheel alignment and the report showed it was out of alignment but was rectified.Although its worth mentioning that when the dealership did a test drive they didnt think it was a problem. I am unaware which machine they used but the dealership used Merit Tyres to carry out the wheel alighment.

    There was no change and the steering was the same, with the steering wheel centre the car veers to the right. The dealership said they were unable to help further as they had done the wheel alignment and they could not replicate the problem. I am not sure why as there is clearly a problem.

    I then took the car myself at my own cost to independent who uses a Hunter wheel alignment system. They found it to be slighty out of specification and corrected it. They mentioned that if there is still a problem there might be an issue with suspension etc? The car has only done 11500 miles and is still within factory warranty.

    We have paid a lot of money for the car and we seem to be stuck with this problem. This has obviously spoiled the experience of owning another Honda as we have never any kind of problem with previous Jazz models.

    If it is useful I can try to upload the wheel alignment results if needed but could someone please offer some advice on how best to proceed?
     
  2. legend-ary Moderator Staff Team

    United Kingdom Legend The Big Smoke
    3,800
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    Hello @salmansandhu and welcome to HK.

    One of the more experienced members might be able to help you out but let me start off by something simple I thought of while I was reading your post. You do have very low mileage car so it is a bit odd that it is pulling to the right on its own.
    Assuming all your tyre pressures are correct, forget whether the steering wheel looks dead centre or not, is the car able to drive dead straight forward at all? if you can safely do it, what happens when you let go of the steering for a second? does it immediately pull to the right? Reason I am asking is because are you sure its not the steering wheel that is fitted incorrectly or is tilted to a side for some reason and by centering it forcefully to make it 'look' straight, inadvertently you are steering to the right?

    I had an issue with my car where when going dead straight the steering looked like i had a bit of right lock on. Moving the steering wheel to dead centre meant I was actually adding a bit of left lock. Once I got my worn ball joint replaced, the steering wheel aligned dead centre without needing any alignment.
     
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  3. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
    3,521
    1,051
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    Could be suspension related but then I would have thought the alignment would be fully possible if this were the case?

    This may sound obvious but have you checked the tyre pressures?
     
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  4. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    @salmansandhu - just a couple of things to confirm.

    - did you buy the car from new, or as an approved used from a Honda dealer? If so, and you haven't had satisfaction from the supplying dealer, I'd suggest trying another one as the warranty is valid at all Honda dealers.

    - if the dealer currently says that they can't rectify the problem, suggest going out in the car with them for a test drive. It may well help if you can show them the issue as you are used to it.

    - if you still don't get satisfaction, I'd ask the dealer to contact Honda UK technical on your behalf.

    The comments about tyre pressures etc. are correct, but as it is under warranty and has been into the dealer, I'd expect them to have checked things like that first.

    Such a shame to have an issue like this after no problems with previous Jazz models, but hopefully you can get to a resolution soon.
     
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  5. salmansandhu Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Salman London
    9
    4
    Many thanks for all the replies so far. My apologies I did not mention some details that may have answered some of the questions. I did check tyre pressures a few times myself and was told the supplying dealership did also.

    I will have to try Legend-ary's suggestion of leaving the steering wheel and see if it drives straight. If it still pulls to right what does this mean?

    To answer First Honda's questions :

    This was purchased as a approved used car from a Honda dealership and one of the reasons for the buying choice was that it still had the balance of 1 year manufacturers warrany as it was only 2 years old.

    You mention of taking it to another dealership which I have thought about but I am just worried about having spend my own money. Do you think if I explain that wheel alignment has been done 2 times they would look into this matter a warranty issue and therefore not charge me unfairly?

    Your suggestion about Honda UK technical, can I ask any dealer to contact them or is it ultimately their decision.Just want to know so I have all the facts to hand.

    I was always a Honda fan but this experience has left me quite disappointed. However I still hope that somehow this can be resolved.
     
  6. SpeedyGee Administrator Staff Team

    England Speedy Birmingham
    14,999
    5,591
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    What condition are the tyres in @salmansandhu ?

    If other avenues get exhausted try asking the dealer to "rotate the wheels", probably trying rear ones on the front and front ones on the back and see how the car performs.

    As you only just bought the car you have no history of what has happened previously to the car. Something simple like curbing the car even at low speeds could damage something in the suspension that visually may be hard to see but the damage is there. When it comes to alignment geometry 1 or 2 degrees make a big difference.

    Hang in there, this problem could occur on any car, it's not a Honda issue as such.
    - - - Updated - - -
    Oh the other thing to have checked is brakes, highly unlikely at this young age and mileage but just need to ensure the brakes aren't binding on one side.
     
    Last edited: Friday 18th Dec, 2015
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  7. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    @salmansandhu

    I'd say this is all about how you phrase the question with the dealer.

    Personally I'd be very clear with them that the alignment has been checked, and is fine, but the problem persists so they need to investigate other causes.

    On the subject of Honda UK (technical) what I meant (sorry, I wasn't that clear) was that if the dealer persists in saying there is nothing wrong but you say there is, then either you or they can contact Honda to open a 'case' and get further help and advice.

    Personally I'd give the dealer one more chance, and try to go out for a drive with them. Stress that you've been a loyal Honda Jazz owner, and that you haven't had this problem before.

    Hope that helps? Just stay calm and polite, but clear that there is an issue, that you aren't satisfied, and that you need it sorted under warranty ASAP.
     
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  8. Bomber209 Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Lanky Aberdeen
    99
    36
    Hi, I bought a Renault 21 many years ago that had the same problem, it turned out to a kink in the subframe, all the alignment checks were good, until you drove it, then the steering/suspension geometry changed.
     
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  9. salmansandhu Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Salman London
    9
    4
    @SpeedyGee from what I can see visually the tyres are in good condition. I don't think the supplying dealership rotated the tyres. But I mentioned this the independent where I had the wheel alignment done (Hunter system) and he looked at the tyres and didnt think they should cause an issue. They looked in good condition.

    However at this stage perhaps rotating them is worth a try.

    I think taking stock of what everyone has said here so far, I need to approach the supplying dealership one more time and ask them to look at it. If they are unwilling then perhaps find another dealership that will look at this for me. The important aspect for me is this is done under warranty and I will make it clear to them. As it seems unfair that I have to rectify an issue that came with the car. I will update the post once I have an update. Although I suspect this will be after Christmas now.

    @Bomber209 just out interest you mentioned you had this problem on a Renault 21 and it was the subframe, were you able to correct it and what was involved?
     
  10. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    I think that sounds about right @salmansandhu

    I'd just make it very clear at the outset that this fault was present when you bought the car, that they have tried X and Y without resolving it so far, and that you shouldn't have to pay for them to investigate further as the car is still covered by the 'new car' 3 year Honda warranty.

    Part of me thinks you should just take it to another Honda dealer now, but I guess giving the supplying dealer one more chance - as they know the history of what they have looked at already - makes sense.

    :goodluck:
     
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  11. 2.4 8thGen Valued Contributor ★ ★ ★ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Brett Bristol
    493
    241
    1
    If the car is pulling to the right then there is a problem and it's not the road.
    As most cars will stray slightly to the the left with the slope of any road.
    If Honda has looked into alignment and suspension and all ok then it could be your power steering at fault.
    I'm thinking have got EPS fitted.
    Maybe one to look at if everything else is in order.
     
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  12. Bomber209 Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Lanky Aberdeen
    99
    36
    Salman Hi, Yes I managed to get the body shop to straighten it. I think they had to cut it and then re-weld it. Not an easy job but it worked. I found the problem by doing symmetry checks and using a straight edge where I could.
     
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  13. salmansandhu Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Salman London
    9
    4
    Our nightmare continues as any hope of getting this resolved under warranty became even more distant today.

    I contacted the supplying dealer today and advised that after having the wheel alignment checked/done again there is still a problem. I politely told them that there is still an issue. But they replied that they had carried out an alignment and there was nothing else they could do. I mentioned to them I was unhappy and could they raise this with Honda to correct under warranty, Their response was there is no warranty for such items even for new cars.

    I then proceeded to contact another dealership local to me and explained the entire situation. The person I spoke to took the time to listen to my issue and understood my situation. However he said there was little chance of processing this under warranty as it could have been caused by the previous owner. It should really be addressed by the supplying dealer and if they don't then I should complain to Honda directly. However he has agreed to take the car out for a test drive tomorrow morning.

    I will see what they say tomorrow and post back here.

    Very depressing state of events though just before Christmas. We feel like they have taken our money and we are of no use anymore as customers. If we wanted this kind of treatment then we could have just bought the car from a private seller rather than pay the premium of going to the dealership.
     
  14. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    I'm really sorry to hear this @salmansandhu

    Hopefully the second dealer will help. One thing I didn't ask previously was whether the car has done this since you've had it, or is it something that has just started happening?

    It does sound as though the supplying dealer is trying to wash his hands of this, which isn't acceptable as the car does have a warranty - new and approved used.

    The key for me is what exactly the supplying dealer is saying.

    Are they saying:

    "We've looked into the issue, but can't find anything wrong having checked everything."

    OR

    "You told us the car was pulling to the right, so we've done an alignment check."

    The two are very different. IMHO - accepting that I'm no expert on the warranty - you have purchased a car under warranty with a fault. The supplying dealer should investigate that fault, and correct it if there is an issue. If the issue is caused by something that has happened during the previous life of the car i.e. before you got it, then I think that should be covered by the Honda Approved Used warranty, as the cars are (well, should be) thoroughly checked prior to sale and delivery.

    Your Honda Warranty - Owners - Cars - Honda

    Personally I'd wait to see what dealer number two says, cross my fingers, and if there still isn't a solution contact Honda UK myself and ask them to help resolve things.

    Contact Us | Cars | Honda UK
     
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  15. salmansandhu Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Salman London
    9
    4
    @FirstHonda

    The car has had this fault since we took delivery. So its not something that has developed under our ownership of the car.

    The supplying dealer has said that they could not find a fault but had carried out alignment check in which the alignment was corrected. Although when we remind them that this was present when we took delivery there does not seem to be any comment on this. So although not specifically said I suppose what they are trying to say is ""We've looked into the issue, but can't find anything wrong having checked everything and done a wheel alignment.Thats all that can be done"

    Lets see what the second dealer has to say today and will update the post later.

    Many thanks though for posting the links, so at least I have those available to contact Honda if need be. Unless the second dealer dismisses it as normal , although for life of me I can not see how it can be "normal".
     
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  16. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    :goodluck:

    Happy Christmas - hopefully you'll get it sorted soon.
     
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  17. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
    3,521
    1,051
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    I guess this is the problem with main dealers becoming more like fitters rather than engineers. I had a similar experience with my turbo and ended up going to an experienced motor engineer and paid for a report proving that it was the turbo. Cost me about £70 but cheaper than me getting the turbo fixed because I could then get it done under warranty.
     
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  18. salmansandhu Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Salman London
    9
    4
    A belated Happy New year to all.

    Further to the previous posts I took the car to another dealer and I am happy to report they have resolved the original issue.

    They took the car on a test drive with me in the passenger seat and almost instantly saw the problem as I had described. Credit to them as they did carry out a fairly long drive on various road conditions. He said that it appeared that the steering wheel was not centralised with the trackrods and this is something that should have really been picked up and corrected during the wheel alignment.

    I wish given two options :

    1) To take it back to the original dealer and ask them to repair the fault

    or

    2) They could correct the issue but it would be chargeable as this would not be covered under the Honda warranty as its really an adjustment.

    I took the decision to let them do the work since they had idenified the fault, which no one at the supplying dealer picked up on.
    I paid £70 and it drives much better now!. They even took it out on another test drive once completing the work to make sure.

    So the saga is finally over!

    Many thanks to all the advice given on this forum which gave me some motivation to progress this. I was sure that we had ended up with an expensive problem.

    I agree entirely with @ArcticFire that more and more dealers simply want to check in cars and check them out again for servicing. If there is something that needs investigating or resolving its much harder.

    I have started to think that its probably best just to buy a brand new car and at least that way you know the history of the car. But aside from the cost I am sure there are other issues with this approach also.
    - - - Updated - - -
    @Ichiban I did see your post in the new owners thread I started about posting some pictures.

    I will post some pictures as soon as possible. The car needs a good clean but need to find the time and motivation to do this in the cold and damp weather.
     
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  19. legend-ary Moderator Staff Team

    United Kingdom Legend The Big Smoke
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    2,258
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    So by the sounds of it the steering wheel wasn't aligning with the steering direction? Glad that it is finally sorted.
     
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  20. salmansandhu Junior Member ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    United Kingdom Salman London
    9
    4
    Hi @legend-ary yes thats my understanding of how they explained it to me.

    Still can not understand how the original dealer could not see there was a problem.

    Not sure how the steering got in this state, could the previous owner hitting a pot hole cause this?