Suspension, Steering and Brakes Odd steering characteristic. Me or the car?

Discussion in '8th Generation (2008-2015) [Acura TSX]' started by Aspman, Wednesday 18th Jun, 2014.

  1. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    Recently acquired a 2010 Accord Tourer. Approved used.
    Long story to follow...

    On delivery the car was steering heavily to the left. Hard to describe but the steering seemed to want to 'flop' about 15deg left if let go. This wasn't apparent on the test drive the week before.

    However the MOT cert had an advisory for a steering rack issue. I don't have the MOT it was sent off with documents for the transfer of my cherished plate.
    The car also had a bit of loose trim around the windscreen.

    Honda took the car in a couple of days later and took it to their usual body shop who have a Hunter alignment rig. When I picked up the car I was told that the front passenger wheel was 18deg out and all was well now.

    Driving home I felt the car still wasn't right and still had a tendency to go left, more than the camber of the road would suggest (I drive single carriageway roads mostly so a stronger camber than a motorway)

    Phoned Honda and they agreed to test the car again at the same time the trim was getting fixed.

    Picked the car up again and they said they'd realigned the steering wheel this time. And all was well.

    Driving home it felt very much the same as before. Maybe a bit better, maybe not.

    Thinking it might be me not the car I took the wife's car (a BMW 116i) out on the same stretch of road. Certainly the camber took the car to the left at about the same rate as the accord but it didn't feel so odd.

    • It's very hard to describe but on a road with a camber it feels like the steering always wants to fall to the left so it takes more constant pressure to the right to hold it straight.
    • The trim directly behind the steering wheel isn't straight. I'm aware that alignment in a dashboard isn't always perfect but this does exaggerate the angle of the steering wheel.
    • The steering maybe feels slightly lumpen around the straight ahead point. Almost like to go right is uphill to go left is down hill.

    I'm a bit OCD with things being aligned so this is irritating me. I'll get over it if I'm just taking badly to a change of car. I had my previous Octavia VRS for 7yr.

    any comments / suggestions?
     
    Loading...
  2. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
    3,521
    1,051
    7
    You'd die if you had my car then! lol I've had a bad run with suspension issues since I got the car in November and I suspect Mazda didn't beef it up properly to cope with the extra power in the first place but I'm sure the previous owner hasn't been very careful. My Accord on the other hand has been near perfect with the suspension, other than a bit of tramlining but different tyres fixed that.

    Have you tried a large flat car park to see if it still pulls? Did you get a 4 wheel before and after alignment report from them?

    If it makes you feel any better here's what I've done to my suspension since January 2014:

    Front Lower Rear Control Arms
    Front Lower Front Arms
    Front Upper Wishbone Arms
    Front Springs
    Front Shock Absorbers
    Front Drop Links
    Rear Springs
    Rear Shock Absorbers
    Rear Anti Roll Bar Bushes
    Rear Drop Links
    Rear Differential Rear Mount Bushes replaced with Poly Bushes
    Rear Differential Front Mount upgraded to Turbine Tech one with Poly Bushes

    And it's getting the front ARB bushes and another alignment done tomorrow!

    The rest of the car is fine though lol
     
    Loading...
  3. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    Getting a bit of flat land it tricky round here ;-)

    It feels to me like the car is still pointing left when the wheel is straight ahead. I've had off centre steering before and it doesn't feel like that. Care brakes true as well.

    Honda have kept the alignment reports to themselves. I'm considering getting it done again at another garage I know is good with a Hunter set up.
     
    Loading...
  4. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,129
    6,381
    516
    Have they checked the tyres for trueness and the rims ?
     
    Loading...
  5. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    I assume not. Tyre wear is even all round.

    When I get some time I'm going to rotate the tyres front to back.

    I had a longer drive today and it does just seem like the car is very prone to tramlining. It might even be me just feeling the electric power steering as odd vs my previous electro hydraulic setup.
     
    Loading...
  6. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,129
    6,381
    516
    Hi mate can I ask How did you check the tyres were round ?
     
    Loading...
  7. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    Well I checked for odd wear. My previous Octy would wear rear tyres like 50p pieces if it wasn't checked. But I'm assuming a knackered allowed would do more than pull the steering.

    "2. Steering. It's simply awful. Never driven anything like it, and I've driven a lot of cars. It wanders all over the place on country roads, you have to be constantly vigilant if you don't want to end up in a ditch because of some tiny indentation in the road that my previous BMW wouldn't even have noticed. I believe this is known as tramlining. The second issue is the 'stiffness' of the steering, not so bad at lower speeds around town but dreadful when cruising on motorways, dual carriageways etc. The best way to describe it is to image a two mile stretch of dual carriageway which is on a very slight curve so you have to hold the steering at a slight turn. It actually makes my hand ache it takes so much effort to hold it there. It's like the car desperately wants to go straight - unless it hits a tiny indentation lol, when it then wants to drive into a hedge. I've checked all the type pressures and they're normal"

    Maybe a bit more extreme than I'd describe mine but the feeling of the steering wandering depending on the road and being oddly weighted is definitely what I feel.
     
    Loading...
    hedleyf likes this.
  8. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
    30,129
    6,381
    516
    Sod that Bavarian loving monkey or that advise ..if your tyres are not round on amount of wheel alignment will fix it.strange I have a 8th gen and it sublime handling ? Strange that
     
    Loading...
  9. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
    3,521
    1,051
    7
    I got my alignment done yesterday and it's sorted all my steering problems. It's amazing how much of an impact alignment has! lol I'd definitely look at trying another place.
     
    Loading...
  10. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    Yup I think that's got to be done.

    Got my new V5 today so I can put my plates back on woohoo.
     
    Loading...
  11. Phil1978 Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    Phil Salisbury
    610
    208
    1
    Eh - up I recognise that avatar, welcome from a fellow ex Skoda owner, I hope you get the fault sorted so you can start enjoying your new car properly.
     
    Loading...
    Aspman likes this.
  12. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    Aye aye

    yes I'm still haunting Briskoda yet.

    Still not 100% there even is a problem or if I'm just taking bad after driving a VRS for 7yr.
     
    Loading...
  13. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    If it helps, I often do long motorway runs in my 8th Generation Accord and with the cruise control on tend to hold the steering wheel at the bottom with just a couple of fingers (I know, I KNOW!) with no issues at all in terms of the steering "wandering."

    On A and B roads I haven't noticed any issues, either. Like the correspondent above, I have also driven a lot of different cars over the years and my Accord doesn't (in my opinion) have any issues in this area.
     
    Loading...
    Aspman likes this.
  14. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    again I'm struggling to put into words teh oddness. On a normal A road with a camber it just feels like the pressure needed on the wheel to counter the camber is excessive. On a road without camber this can go away completely. Lumps and bumps in the road always send the wheel to the left. Pulling away from stand a still, hands off, with the wheel dead centre or even to the right it will quickly try to centre but goes past this and rests about 10deg left.

    I'm going to get it in for 4x alignment somewhere else to make sure I get the report.
     
    Loading...
  15. FirstHonda Premium Member Club Supporter

    ^^ Sounds like getting the alignment checked is the way to go, for your peace of mind if nothing else.

    I'm going to be extra paranoid now next time I drive my Accord, to see whether it does the same thing...:Laughing:
     
    Loading...
  16. PeteMM Premium Member Club Supporter

    Northern Ireland Pete Belfast, UK
    854
    454
    Allignment is key on the Accords.

    Those who have never had one feeling like that will never know the uncertainty you feel when driving it.

    The best bet is to have the car setup properly by an independent with a good alignment system. I don;t know where you are based, but TGM in Fleet, Hampshire will do a fantastic job should you go there.

    All my issues were resolved by using the settings for the DC5 Fast Road Set Up, although without camber adjustment I am yet to be able to dial it in fully. From memory you should be 1degree camber all round, 1mm toe in at the front and 1mm toe out at the rear. I will try and confirm this as soon as possible for you.
     
    Loading...
  17. PeteMM Premium Member Club Supporter

    Northern Ireland Pete Belfast, UK
    854
    454
    Actually found the TGM safe setup sheet

    TGM FRSU safe.
     
    Loading...
    Aspman likes this.
  18. Aspman Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Paul
    54
    25
    Cheers.

    Going to use Target Tyres in Perth.

    I know they have a Hunter rig via alignmycar.com.

    Kwikfit have it too, but give a monkey a laptop and it's till a monkey
     
    Loading...
    FirstHonda likes this.
  19. Nels Moderator Staff Team

    Hope they can sort this out for you.
    Keep us posted.
     
    Loading...
  20. ArcticFire-Account Closed Banned Getting Started

    Scotland Graham Scotland
    3,521
    1,051
    7
    Perth may be a bit far but Kenneth Brown Engineering in Hillington is known to be one of the best up here. They are all very highly trained I believe.

    They did an excellent job with my car.
     
    Loading...
    Aspman likes this.