Suspension, Steering and Brakes Type-R suspension & brakes on my 2005 2.2 cdti

Discussion in '7th Generation (2003-2008) [Acura TSX]' started by john_y, Thursday 29th Nov, 2012.

  1. john_y Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Hi,

    In the long term I am thinking about sourcing Type-R suspension & brakes on my 2005 2.2 cdti - am I mad or sane?

    Best wishes

    John
     
  2. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
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    Really John any reasoning behind this radical step?
     
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  3. SayamaAccord Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    People have done the calipers, but will the suspension fit?
     
  4. john_y Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Madness, no to make it stop and handle better
     
  5. SpeedyGee Administrator Staff Team

    England Speedy Birmingham
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    Its not uncommon for people to use the front calipers from the Accord Type-R as they are dual pistoned and therefore give more even pressure on the pad.

    Not heard of anyone swapping over the suspension.
     
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  6. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
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    Even if you could fit the Tyre R suspension which I highly doubt the spring and dampers are tuned for sporty performance and not a oil burning lardy engine.

    That extra weight will wreck those dampers in no time, if you want Tyre R suspension by a Type-R.
     
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  7. Primarycare Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    United Kingdom Primary c Northampton
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    Tend to agree with CJ Type-R is tuned to the Type-R
    The heavy diesel dump will wreak the dampers and winter do the springs much good. what is wrong with the stock set up? mine is fine. I consistently run rings round our inferior German friends in BMWs without to much problem.

    Depending on mileage might be worth replacing shocks and possible even look at some polly bushes to tighten it up a bit?
     
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  8. john_y Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Your not a fan of diesels - the engines are becoming lighter - I do understand weight distributiun.?
    The brake upgrade sounds good.
    Even Type-R owners upgrade their suspension.

    Best wishes

    John
     
  9. SayamaAccord Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    Re: Type-R suspension & brakes on my 2005 2.2 cdti

    Yup the brakes are worth doing, if you can find a pair - since this became a fashionable mod the prices of second hand ATR calipers have gone through the roof and they are scarce to find.

    No need to get defensive about the engine. He was just expressing himself in a certain way. They are a lot heavier which makes a diesel car handle very very differently to a petrol - it's really obvious when you drive one and then the other. It's not an issue for many people but for some such as myself it is a big deal. It is the No 2 reason I went for a petrol.

    People aren't having a pop, they're just making the point that the heavy front end is a characteristic of the oil burner engine. It goes with the much better fuel economy. But no amount of tweaking is going to change that characteristic.
    - - - Updated - - -
    Sorry I forgot to mention the higher torque as well!
     
  10. john_y Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    Re: Type-R suspension & brakes on my 2005 2.2 cdti

    Fair enough - no pop intended!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Thinking out loud - maybe the accord 2.2 I-CDTI Type-S (180ps) suspension is more sporty than the 140bhp engine and is a better comprimise- anyone have any constructive thoughts please?
    Also, I wondered what the differences are between the 180 (Type-S) and 140 BHP/ ps diesel 2.2 I-CDTI engines - is it more than a ECU recalibration - are the transmissions the same.
    I know the diesel engines use garrett gt1752v turbos which is the same as the vag boys call a hybrid which outputs up to 220 BHP from the 8v (arl,asz) 1.9 tdi engine.

    Best wishes

    John
     
    Last edited: Saturday 1st Dec, 2012
  11. SayamaAccord Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    It really depends what you're looking for, and at the end of the day only you can answer that.

    Diesels aren't natural performance engines, which is why you don't see them on a racetrack, but with the hefty torque and a turbo they can have very quick feet with the the mid-range acceleration on the road.

    You can get 180-190 BHP by remapping yours, but this is achieved by injecting more fuel into the engine, which can have detrimental effects such as shortening clutch and driveshaft life and wearing the engine timing chain quicker due to more soot in the engine from the additional fuel. Insurers don't like it either and make you pay if you tell them. If you don't tell them you are in effect driving uninsured.

    The Type-S is a superb car apparently. Jeremy Clarkson test drove one for his Sunday Times article and gave it a fantastic write-up, and you can imaging how many cars he sees and of what quality. Honda have upgraded it to cope with the extra power. I don't know how exactly - IchibanAccord will know. So if you want the high torque diesel Accord that is definitely the way to go.

    Or maybe the ATR or CTR would be a better solution to what you're looking for. They are designed and built to go fast but with the VTEC petrol engine you have to use high revs to get the best out of them unlike a diesel.

    The other thing which is often overlooked but not by you is handling. A lot of people looking for performance just focus on engine output but it is only half the picture. If you have ever driven in a two seater with a low centre of gravity you'll know what I mean. It is unbelievable how much better they handle than a normal family car such as the Accord. I have driven or been driven in Mercs, Jags, BMWs, Lexus etc, but the most enjoyable driving experience I have ever had by a long long way, was in a little Toyota MR2 two seater with a just little revvy 1.6 engine, but in the hands of a good driver (not me). It cornered like it was on rails, and it was fantastic. We were overtaking loads of cars which were much much faster and more powerful on paper, just because our car had so much better handling, so we could drive it much faster than those cars could be driven on a normal road. Within legal limits of course. :Wink:

    So if you're looking for performance, I think it's worth asking yourself, what kind of performance.

    But if you really want to go fast, it should be done on a track, not the road.
     
    Last edited: Saturday 1st Dec, 2012
  12. john_y Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    No offence but diesel technology improvements has led to more and more diesel racing cars since circa 1999 - Simpson's Golf 1.9 tdi rally car - Nurburgring - Le Mans 2004 Taurus Sports- Audi R10 TDI, Peugeot 908 HDI, 2013 Mazda 2.2 skyactiv-d lmp2, Allard golf 1.9 tdi race winner in vw racing cup, WTCC leon 2.0 tdi series championship - the list goes on!!!
    Fuel performance is the same as fuel economy.
     
    Last edited: Sunday 2nd Dec, 2012
  13. SayamaAccord Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    None taken, but these are exceptions that prove the rule, in my opinion anyway.
     
  14. john_y Club Member ★ ☆ ☆ ☆ ☆

    I understand your point - but petrol engines have decades of development whereas diesel engines haven't - the first DI car engine was sold in 1995 - only 17 years ago.

    Best wishes

    John
     
  15. Ichiban Founder Staff Team

    England CJ Leeds
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    I have never seen lemans as racing it a marathon and diesel being inherently fuel efficient compared to petrols they will win all day long. Racing is speed not running the furthest on a limited supply of fuel.
     
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  16. SayamaAccord Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    ...and according to Wiki diesel engines have been around since the 1890s. :Wink:

    I suspect we're getting slightly off topic though.

    If you like diesels then you're not alone on AOC. :Thumbup:
     
  17. Racy Jace Expert Advisor ★ ★ ★ ★ ★

    HI guys, I've just done a quick google and found this link where the article says that diesels have an unfair advantage in Touring cars and some teams want to ban them:Unknown:

    TouringCarTimes - TcTalk: Ban diesel in WTCC now!


    From Wiki about Jason Plato
    Diesels seem pretty good on the track to me:Wink:

    Any way, If your going to change your suspension I would of thought buying something that was designed with the car in mind would be better. I would maybe get some coil overs and up rate the anti roll bars. That should give you a much more sporty and agile ride that I think your looking for.
     
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  18. SayamaAccord Top Contributor ★ ★ ★ ★ ☆

    I was thinking more in terms of bespoke racing cars than touring cars :Smile: